Encore Episode: The Real Cause To Your Chronic Pain Part 2
Episode 146
Today on Integrative wellness radio, we continue the conversation with part 2 of the pain series with Dr. Nicole and Dr. Nick. Last week the duo talked about the emotional and physical ties to pain. In part 2 we go more into how infections can present themselves in the form of pain, in particular in the lower back and knee pain. Interested in working with IWG? Book a complimentary consult call to learn more using this link: https://bit.ly/IWRcall2022 Noteworthy Time Stamps: 02:00 Where does pain really stem from? 07:50 All symptoms are connected 15:13 Your immune system is in charge of everything 20:35 Phantom pain and its origins 23:15 We need to be conscious of our sleeping environment 30:35 You don’t have to live with toxicity forever 35:55 The special care for your liver 43:56 IWG’s Goal
Topics: pain, part, back, unknown, integrative, episode, cause, physical
Key takeaways from this episode
- Sometimes I tend to lose myself when the- Welcome back to another episode of Integrative Wellness Radio.
- Nick and Dr. **Unknown:** Nicole to learn more about the top trends in integrative medicine to learn about what the limitations are with testing and what you can do to start your health journey.
- Nick once again. **Unknown:** So we have part two of our pain series.
- Uh, so today we're really, um, kind of piggybacking off of everything we talked about in the previous episode, which really had to do more so with some emotional ties to some of the physical pain that we can deal with.
- And what I found to be really, really interesting is as I, uh, moved into being more of an integrative physician is that a lot of people's low back pain was actually due to referred pain from their gut.
Pull quotes
Imagine if medicine actually looked at you as a whole opposed to looking at you as a bunch of separate systems.
Nick and Dr. **Unknown:** Nicole to learn more about the top trends in integrative medicine to learn about what the limitations are with testing and what you can do to start your health journey.
Sometimes I tend to lose myself when the- Welcome back to another episode of Integrative Wellness Radio.
Transcript
**Unknown:** I've been up all night, no sleep. Imagine if medicine actually looked at you as a whole opposed to looking at you as a bunch of separate systems. Dive into Integrative Wellness Radio with Dr. Nick and Dr.
**Unknown:** Nicole to learn more about the top trends in integrative medicine to learn about what the limitations are with testing and what you can do to start your health journey. Sometimes I tend to lose myself when the- Welcome back to another episode of Integrative Wellness Radio. So I am here with Dr. Nick once again.
**Unknown:** So we have part two of our pain series. Uh, so today we're really, um, kind of piggybacking off of everything we talked about in the previous episode, which really had to do more so with some emotional ties to some of the physical pain that we can deal with. And the primary reason we wanted to talk about this on our podcast in the first place is because, um, as chiropractors, being our original doctorate degree, when we were practicing as chiropractors, um, primarily and not doing more integrative medicine, we just found that, you know, there were certain people that did really well with getting physical work done to their body, and then there was a huge portion of people that didn't necessarily see a difference. And I know that for us, we take a full body approach when we do that physical work, so we made sure that we were addressing muscles, ligaments, tendons, joints, et cetera.
**Unknown:** And we found that sometimes that wasn't the problem, and sometimes the problem was stemming from a different root cause. And part of that could have been different, um, emotional things that they were either holding onto from their past, or it could even just be certain fears that were coming up about where they were going in their lives. So that was all in the last episode. Um, so really in my zone of genius, uh, one of the biggest things that I've learned over time is that a lot of pain can actually stem from different types of infections, toxicity, um, as well as even meridian problems.
**Unknown:** Mm-hmm. And that's really what we're gonna elaborate a little bit further on is just some of the things that we've seen, um, with really, really common areas of pain. Uh, 'cause I think that, you know, overall when it comes to the low back, that is such a common complaint is people dealing with low back pain. Uh, there's a lot of people complaining of knee pain, shoulder pain.
**Unknown:** Really, it's all over, but definitely when it comes to low back pain, when you look at the statistics, especially in the US, it's astronomical the amount of people dealing with low back pain. And what I found to be really, really interesting is as I, uh, moved into being more of an integrative physician is that a lot of people's low back pain was actually due to referred pain from their gut. Mm-hmm. A lot of pain honestly is referred.
**Unknown:** Uh, and the interesting part is like when you talk to somebody just on the street, um, they're gonna be, quote, unquote, "like a believer of something or it just doesn't work." Mm-hmm. And the interesting thing is everything works. It's just- What's right for you. Well, yeah.
**Unknown:** What's your problem? It's like for somebody like- Mm-hmm ... I don't believe in acupuncture or I don't believe in chiropractic or this surgery didn't work. Mm-hmm.
**Unknown:** And it's like, well, they were all, they all work, but if that wasn't your underlying problem- Yeah ... it's not gonna help you. Mm-hmm. So it's just understanding of you need what, what...
**Unknown:** You have to figure out what the actually causing the symptom- Mm-hmm ... and then that needs to be worked on. Well, I think my famous phrase is it's not about what you do, it's about how you do it. And, uh, I love what you said about the acupuncture thing because acupuncture, uh, a lot of people actually don't even really know what acupuncture is doing.
**Unknown:** Um, but there's a lot of people talking about acupuncture for fertility. They're talking about it for pain. They're talking about it for, um, golfer's elbow, uh, tennis elbow. You know, there's all of these different claims of, you know, what acupuncture is doing, but at the end of the day, acupuncture is putting needles into your meridians, which we'll talk about a little bit further, um, in order to remove energetic blockages in that meridian.
**Unknown:** So meridians are pretty much channels that are associated with organs. A- a- and don't get me wrong, it's more complex than that, but I wanna keep it rather simple for people. Um, but I think that Dr. Nick has a really, really amazing story about a woman who came in with migraines, um, which is obviously pain, painful, um, that had a lot of different treatments.
**Unknown:** She went to neurologists. She worked with, um- She went to every specialist imaginable. Yeah ... yeah, different headache specialists.
**Unknown:** Yeah. Experts in migraines, et cetera. And, you know, I'll let you elaborate further, but, you know, her problem ended up not being anything that was on her radar or on the radar of any of the other physicians that she saw. No, and interesting you bring this up because we'll go for full circle 'cause just a client I saw yesterday actually just for chiropractic, at the end he goes, "I know this probably doesn't make any sense- Yeah.
**Unknown:** ... but, um, what do you think about this, uh, symptom?" Uh, so that will be my, my finishing up to that. Okay. But, uh, if you want the whole story, you can...
**Unknown:** It's not up yet, but my TEDx talk in Chamonix, uh, France, I also gave this example in there, and, uh, through the slides you can actually, um, see the actual- Pattern ... pattern that these symptoms were following. Um, but yeah, like you said, she'd seen over a dozen specialists, neurologists, um, orthopedic physicians just all over- Mm-hmm ... uh, for having these really intense migraine headaches, um, on the side of her head, and nobody could figure out what was happening because it ended up not being actually a head problem at all.
**Unknown:** Um, digging deep just in the evaluation, we found that she had some gastrointestinal problems that, um, led to actually having some loose stools. As a physician, we know anytime somebody has loose stools, we're looking at the liver and the gallbladder. Mm-hmm. You know, the gallbladder produces bile, which really helps- Mm-hmm ...
**Unknown:** to break down the fats and the proteins. But when that's not happening- Mm-hmm ... our fats aren't broken down. They're just passed through the stool.
**Unknown:** And we all know fat floats, so it's a simple question for a physician to be like, "If your stools float, we know there's probably a problem in the liver-gallbladder, um, breaking that down."And through some of the other evaluations that we do, uh, one of the technologies in our office actually evaluates the different meridians. And in doing so, it evaluated, uh, showing that her gallbladder meridian was very stressed. And at that time, I actually didn't have tons of background on where this meridian was traveling through the body. Um, so got on Google University and was like, "Where's this gallbladder meridian go?" And traveled it up, and I was like, "Oh, wow, this is, this is freaking crazy." Mm-hmm.
**Unknown:** Um, it literally comes up from the gallbladder, wraps around the shoulder, comes up over the head, and then crosses right back over the side of the head where she was having these headaches. Pretty much which is the temple. Yep. Where, right where she was having these headaches.
**Unknown:** And, um, I showed it to her, and she's like, "What?" Mm-hmm. Just mind blown. And then we did a type of muscle testing called autonomic response testing, uh, where you can go through and challenge different parts of the body, different meridians, different organ systems. A cool thing is you can actually challenge and see if they're connected together to the same problem- Mm-hmm ...
**Unknown:** or if they're completely different, separate. And we found that her gallbladder was connected to, uh, the headaches, and that was, the meridian was definitely causing stress to there. Um, then we were able to challenge and really figure out exactly which, like, supplements, which dietary recommendations, what was gonna- gonna help her, um, heal the meridian and the gallbladder. And a couple weeks later, she'd never had a headache since, and this had been going on for years.
**Unknown:** Mm-hmm. And she was just like, "This is insane." Well, I think it's important for people to kind of understand too that all symptoms are connected. Um, because you mentioned the comment about, like, her bowel movements being a little bit off, which, like, as physicians, like, when we have somebody say that, we kind of know that it might be tied to something going on in- in the gut, like the gallbladder- Yeah ... for instance.
**Unknown:** And in the consult she was like, "Really, why are we talking about this?" Yeah. Well, I- I think it's interesting too because everything is connected. Um, and, you know, one of the other symptoms that I find that people report in their initial consultation when they have a gallbladder issue is they often say they're lactose intolerant. And they're not always lactose intolerant.
**Unknown:** They just don't do well with the fats that's in dairy, and that's why they're assuming they're lactose intolerant. So that's, like, a really common thing. So if you're lactose intolerant and you're also dealing with, you know, headaches or migraines, you might be dealing with a really similar issue, which is n- you know, they're connected, and your gallbladder is actually the root to your headaches that are on the side of your head in the temple area. And finishing that story up yesterday, got done, uh, doing a chiropractic workup with a client, and he goes, "This ...
**Unknown:** You probably don't have an answer. It's really weird. Uh, but I've just been getting these weird sensations on the side of my head." He's like, "It literally travels up and then just crosses right back over here." And I'm like, "Oh, I know what this one is." Um, so I literally got on, pulled up the gallbladder meridian, and before I could even say anything, "That's the pattern. Mm-hmm.
**Unknown:** That's the pattern." Mm-hmm. And I go, "Yeah, your gallbladder's not happy." And, uh, he goes, "I went to my- my primary a couple weeks ago and they said, 'I don't think your gallbladder's doing so well.'" And he goes, "And it's creating this?" He's like, "This is insane." Um, so he didn't, at that time, wanna actually, uh, get too deep, uh, with it 'cause it quote-unquote "wasn't causing him enough pain," uh, to do something about it at that time. But I just like, "Hey, here's a simple thing. We'll see if it works." Um, and I gave him, um, Betafood from Standard Process, which is a whole food supplement.
**Unknown:** And it's literally just, uh, really condensed, uh, concentrated beet and beet leaf juice. Mm-hmm. Um, so- Yeah, beets are really, really good for the- the gallbladder. So we'll see if that changes anything for him, but it was a- a cheap $17 hopeful fix.
**Unknown:** Yeah. Well, that's the thing is not everybody's necessarily wanting to dig a little bit deeper with their pain. Um, but, you know, this kind of, like, brings me to another story in relation to the knees. And, um, we have a therapy in our office called Soundwave therapy.
**Unknown:** Yeah. And we used Soundwave- A good learning experience. Yeah. So we've- we've used Soundwave since we pretty much opened our business, and, uh, we've used it for a lot of physical issues.
**Unknown:** So if somebody comes in with, um, you know, reporting that they have a lot of joint pain or if they have a lot of scar tissue because they've had injuries or surgeries, et cetera, um, the Soundwave is fantastic for that. It breaks down scar tissue, it modulates the healing process, and really helps people to reduce their pain very fast. Like, usually right after the session they're like, "Wow, my pain has significantly decreased." And increased range of motion. Yeah.
**Unknown:** Yeah. So we had tons of success, uh, and we still do with the Soundwave therapy, but specifically we had ... This was before we were truly more of an integrative practice, and we had a patient who came in and we worked on his knee, like, super excited that we were gonna help him pretty much eradicate his knee pain. And when he came back, he pretty much said, "Do not touch me with that machine." And it was the first time we ever had that experience.
**Unknown:** We were like, "Whoa, what- what happened?" And he's like, "My knee blew up. I was in so much pain. I couldn't even move." And, um, when we actually took it a step further and we started doing better testing, it actually turned out that this patient had strep in his knee. So those of you listening, yes, strep, like the strep in your throat.
**Unknown:** So people think that ... I guess there's, this is two parts. So first of all, we think that strep, as an example, can only be in your throat, which is completely false. You can have strep in your sinuses.
**Unknown:** You can have strep in your joints. You can have strep in your organs. You can have strep anywhere, and it primarily moves via your lymphatic system. So your lymph nodes are everywhere in the body, but they do move.
**Unknown:** And that is kind of- Your lymph nodes don't move, but things travel through the lymph. Yes. Yeah. So what's gonna happen is you can easily have things transport through those lymph vessels.
**Unknown:** So with that being said, you can easily have something that started in the throat but ended upGoing somewhere else And even like a stomach bug can move to the liver, to the pancreas, or even to the lymph down to the knees 'Cause everything is connected- 100%. Yeah ... is, is really what it comes down to. Um, so with this being said, you know, this was someone who was dealing with knee pain for a long time and was getting surgeries, was, you know, scoping the knee out, cleaning up scar tissue, et cetera, and just kept hitting a roadblock.
**Unknown:** And it was not because it was a true knee problem. Don't get me wrong, the knee was damaged. There was inflammation, there was cartilage damage, but that was because the infection was wreaking havoc on the surrounding tissue. So what happened with the soundwave is the soundwave serves two purposes essentially.
**Unknown:** So it can break down scar tissue and adhesions, so it can even break down adhesions in the lymph nodes if the lymph nodes are clogged with something. So again, the strep can clog up those lymph nodes. So you go in and you start to break that up, and the infection became mobile, and the infection came to the surface because of the technology, and that a l- pretty much caused, caused an immune response. And the immune system came to the scene to be like, "Oh, crap" ...
**Unknown:** and try to clean it all up. And just for those of you that are kind of not understanding that connection is an immune system response is an inflammatory response. So those of you that have- So think if you sprain your ankle, you know? Yeah, it blows up.
**Unknown:** It blows up. There's more blood flow. It's tender. It's warm.
**Unknown:** Exactly. Like everything ... Yep. So if your immune system is attacking something, then it's going to also create that inflammatory response, and that's the same exact thing when we get sick, and especially, say, it's a sore throat, all of this hurts.
**Unknown:** And all- like, we find all of these lymph nodes and the glands are swollen, and it's because of an immune system response. So this is super, super important for people that are dealing with something like rheumatoid arthritis or dealing with fibromyalgia, is these are classified as inflammatory conditions, and they're even classified as autoimmune conditions. So let's, like, take a step back and think about this. So we have an inflammatory condition that is classified as an autoimmune condition, but they say, "Well, we don't know why the immune system starts to attack.
**Unknown:** We just ... You know, i- it's just, um, a de- or a, a defective mechanism that happens. It could be genetics. It could just be that your immune system got confused," and we kind of just play a little dumb when it comes to autoimmune conditions.
**Unknown:** But if you go back to the exact same foundation of what we just said is immune- the immune system is in charge of attacking foreign substances. It's in charge of attacking bacteria, fungus, um, parasite, anything that the, the body is classifying as foreign. So if the immune system is attacking something and then that is an inducing and an inflammatory condition, doesn't it make sense that the autoimmune portion is just the immune system attacking an infection that is in tissue? So if we have rheumatoid arthritis, where does it start?
**Unknown:** It starts in the hands usually, and we get r- terrible hand pain. Our hands blow up. We can't get our rings on and off. We can't open things anymore.
**Unknown:** So one of the most common triggers to the small joints of the body is mold. And what's really interesting is that mold doesn't always necessarily come from your house or, you know, a, a moldy basement or, you know, water damage. Food. Food is one.
**Unknown:** So we get exposed to mold by drinking wine, drinking coffee, eating cheese. Peanuts. Peanuts. Peanuts.
**Unknown:** Peanut butter. Peanut allergy is everywhere. Exactly. Is it a peanut allergy?
**Unknown:** That's a side, side tangent- ... that Nick wants to go on. But it's important for us to understand that we can be exposed to mold from food, and it's all the good stuff, right? The, the wine, the cheese, the, the peanut butter, uh, the coffee.
**Unknown:** But then secondary to that when we're talking about mold is one of the questions that I ask in my consultations that people are not always understanding is I ask them if they've been allergic to penicillin. Actually, first I'll ask them, "Have you ever been exposed to mold?" And everyone's like, "No. No. Absolutely not.
**Unknown:** No, no possible way." And I say, "Okay. Are you allergic to penicillin, the antibiotic?" And they go, "Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've been allergic since I was, like, two." I was like, "Okay." So penicillin is made from penicillium, which is mold. So that means that by two years old they already had mold in their system.
**Unknown:** Is it from a house? Is it from, you know, food? I, I don't know, but all I know is that mold is playing a role in their body. So mold is way more common as a toxin to our human body than people realize, and especially if you were to use Google University and you look up the symptoms of mold toxicity and the symptoms of rheumatoid arthritis, you will be baffled- W- ...
**Unknown:** because they are almost the same. And it's funny, um, maybe not funny, but more ironic, uh, that we think mold is, like, this new concept of- Mm-hmm ... creating all these problems, and I don't even actually know. I might have told you this a, a long time ago.
**Unknown:** This is one of Dr. Nick's side tangents. Um, so I know where you're going with this. But, uh, way back in the day actually when Catholicism was starting, uh, all the priest, um, you know the wands that they have, the water kind of pours out?
**Unknown:** Yep. It's called an aspergillum. And it, when you look at it next to, what, a picture of aspergillus, the, the mold fungi, um- Yeah, aspergillus is a type of mold ... the, they look, uh, similarSo- Mm-hmm ...
**Unknown:** back in the day, priests were really, uh, healers. And the biggest thing they were dealing with is this toxicity to- From Aspergillus mold. Yep. So this- Mm ...
**Unknown:** has been going on for years and years and years and years. Mm-hmm. Um, and it's just ironic that people are always like, "Mold?" Like, why is this... It's like a new concept- ...
**Unknown:** but it's been going on for- And I think- ... for ages ... I think this is one of, like, the most eye-opening things to me because, you know, you read about, you know, especially for me, like diving into the research, like getting certified and understanding, like mold toxicity and how it affects the human body, and personally as a physician it was a little overwhelming because when I started to do the right testing, I was like, "Holy crap, everybody has mold toxicity." So it was like, if everybody has mold toxicity, then why does everybody's symptoms look so different? Not everybody had rheumatoid arthritis but, you know, other people had brain fog, other people had gut issues from it.
**Unknown:** So mold can manifest in, in- Skin issues ... skin issues, yeah. It can manifest in many, many, many different ways. So I guess the w- the really interesting part too is, like when I started to learn more about mold and I started to do testing, I, it became a little bit overwhelming as a physician because I started to realize that, you know, there was a lot of different people that were dealing, uh, with mold issues.
**Unknown:** It was actually pretty common, but it also was very eye-opening that not everybody necessarily had the rheumatoid arthritis, not everybody had the same pain patterns. And the really fascinating thing about mold is that it is both water and fat-soluble. So it can pretty much go into any tissue that it wants. It, it doesn't necessarily just go into those small joints of the hand, but it can also get into the gallbladder- Mm-hmm ...
**Unknown:** and cause more maybe of that, that pattern that goes over the head like we were describing earlier. Um, it can even get into the spinal cord because again, it can get into almost any tissue being water and fat-soluble. So you could easily have tons and tons of back pain that nobody can necessarily figure out. And then with mold being just crazy exacerbated with wifi and EMFs, like- Yeah, and that's, I'm glad that you said that because some people, um, deal with this like phantom pain.
**Unknown:** And I, one of the questions that I ask in my consultation that people are usually looking at me like, "You're, why are you asking me this?" Or they look at me and go, "I can't believe you just said that because I've never said that out loud 'cause I don't want people to think I'm crazy." And what I ask them is, "Do you sometimes have a buzzing or crawling sensation that you almost feel like your phone is on you vibrating, and then you realize it's not your phone?" And they're like, "Oh my gosh, yes, I do feel that sometimes." So one of the reasons why people are getting these weird phantom pains that feel almost vibratory or crawling is if they have mold in the system, maybe it's in their lymph nodes, maybe it's in joints, you know, it, it varies on the person, but when they have something like an Apple Watch or a Fitbit or they're constantly being bombarded with all of the wifi or other types of Bluetooth wireless technologies, they've actually proven at this point that mold will multiply by 600% per week by being exposed to all the Bluetooth and wifi. That's crazy. So when people are talking to me and I see that they have their Apple Watch on or their Fitbit, I'll ask them, be like, "When did your pain get really bad?" Or, "When did you start having that weird phantom pain or, or vibrating pain?" And a lot of times it lines up when they started wearing their device. Yeah.
**Unknown:** So, you know, f- at the end of the day, for us to like live in a bubble and think that, uh, we're gonna escape wifi, i- it's not real life. But at least, the least we can do is try to make our sleeping environments as wifi-free as possible. So if you do have your phone in your room, put it on airplane mode. If you have a router in your bedroom, get it out.
**Unknown:** Or turn it off while you're sleeping. Yeah. You're not using it. Exactly.
**Unknown:** But- It's actually really cool. Um, I think it's, I think it's France. It was definitely the school systems in Europe. That's what I was gonna say.
**Unknown:** Um, but now every single new, uh, school that they build, it's all landline. Mm-hmm. Uh, because the science is out showing that wifi is literally detrimental to our learning- Mm-hmm ... to our mind, to making us sick, more stress on our nervous system.
**Unknown:** So they're like, "Well, yeah, we're not gonna put this in our school systems." Mm-hmm. "This is detrimental to learning. It doesn't actually make any sense." Um, but in the US we have wifi routers in every single classroom. And I get it.
**Unknown:** We, you know, we wanna be more- Mm-hmm ... you know, technologically advanced and, you know, the, the computers are the way of the future, so, you know, e- everything is software, tech, et cetera. So I, I get both sides of it, but I think that we just need to be more conscious of our sleeping environment. Um, and one of the things that people...
**Unknown:** I know that when I found it out, I was completely surprised, but cordless landline phones are actually worse than routers, and they're also worse than cell phones. Hmm. But I'm glad you just said France, because I totally lost my train of thought before, and one of the things that I wanted to say about the mold situation is that mold became a little bit more, um, evident to me when we were in France. And when we were in France, um, we actually had the, the news on in the background when we were in Paris, and I was really intrigued because one of the things that came up was, uh, a whole segment on the news channel about agritech, and they were talking about technology and agriculture and how they're using artificial intelligence and things like that.
**Unknown:** So if anybody's been to France, we all know the wine is fantastic there. Wow. It is the best. And it's a very, uh, it makes you feel very different.
**Unknown:** It doesn't, um, give you a headache. It doesn't do any of those things. And I was very fascinated with, you know, the wine just being so clean and, and just kind of like making you feel different when you drink it.So when I was watching this segment on the news, what they said is that they have, um, these cameras, these- or drones I should say, um, that are artificial intelligence-based that hover over the vineyards in France. And they actually take, um, snapshots of the vines to monitor for fungus, which is mold.
**Unknown:** And if they find the littlest trace of fungus, they go in and rip out that vine so it doesn't spread. And that just became so, um, evident to me that when we talk about mold being on our food, that it's not just this, you know, "Oh, no big deal. Can it really be that bad?" It's, it's a real thing. And in other countries, they're being proactive on making sure that it's not spreading.
**Unknown:** Like, fungus is a disease. And w- we're, you know, if we're not taking those precautions on our produce, on our wheat, on the rice, on the wine, on the coffee beans, like, we could easily be eating these foods that are, like, massively toxic, and we're just not even aware of it. And then, like, transferring that back to pain, it's like all that does is make- Make you inflamed ... make our lymph nodes inflamed.
**Unknown:** And our lymph, when that's not moving and it's stagnant, inflammation gets- occurs. And then if that's by a joint or anywhere else- Mm-hmm ... we're experiencing pain. And I know we talked a little bit about fibromyalgia in the previous episode, and talking about, like, you know, people not being truly happy with themselves from an emotional standpoint can be part of the puzzle- Mm-hmm ...
**Unknown:** when it comes to fibromyalgia. But at the end of the day, like, fibromyalgia, you know, obviously when you do the testing, it could be complex. But what it comes down to is that there is so much neurological stress on the body that is causing your nerves to be super close to threshold. And what that means is, like, you have the slightest stimulus and you're like , um, which is what fibromyalgia is.
**Unknown:** So there are so many things that we get exposed to on a regular basis that are neurotoxic. So one of them is mold, then there's mercury. And so many people are like, "Well, where do I get exposed to mercury?" And I'm like, "Well, anybody who has silver fillings in their mouth has mercury exposure. If you eat fish, you have mercury exposure." So this is not an uncommon exposure.
**Unknown:** And this is actually a really crazy story. I told you this the other day, but this is something that I literally learned a couple of weeks ago. Thank you, Medical Medium. Everyone talks about The Medical Medium, and I think his information is good, but, um, personally, being in clinical practice, I think that there's a lot more going on than just the Epstein-Barr virus.
**Unknown:** Um, but the Epstein-Barr virus does cause a lot of problems for people. Mm-hmm. But side, side tangent, um, when it comes to the mercury, there are so many kids that we test that have mercury in their system at one, two years old. And I remember thinking, like, "How the heck does this happen?" And part of it is, obviously, if, if Mom has had exposure, 'cause Mom had a lot of fillings, or Mom was a pescatarian and only ate fish.
**Unknown:** So all of those can be parts of the puzzle. And it's the first child who gets, what is it, like 80% or something? Of the- of Mom's, uh, heavy metal toxicity. Tha- thank you, Mom.
**Unknown:** I'm first born. But, um, but one of the things that, um, The Medical Medium actually talks about is how mercury is passed down generation to generation, which I definitely agree with because of being in clinical practice. But the thing that I did not know, that you can easily look up and there's information on it, is that the top hats that, um, they man- manufactured back in the day, you know, in the 19- early 1900s, that, um, one of the things that they used to coat the top hats in was mercury. And it was a way to protect the hat and actually make it water-resistant.
**Unknown:** So in the summer months when, you know, males and females were wearing hats, that it could get to the point that this mercury would heat, and it becomes liquid and vapor when it becomes warm. And it would drip down the face and get into the skin, and the eyes, and even the mouth. So that's where the term Mad Hatter comes from. And I thought that that was so fascinating.
**Unknown:** That's wild. And so this is one of the reasons why you could have a child that's super young that maybe is developing neurological issues and, you know, it partly can be because they already have neurotoxins in their system. Well, and then, you know, not to get down this tunnel, um, but it's like then they have a vaccine that takes them over the threshold, and we blame it on the vaccine, but they were already, you know, very unstable in the first place. Well, and I think that's an important point is, you know, there's pro, anti-vaccine, and there's all this talk about it.
**Unknown:** But usually the vaccine is just something that's like the catalyst. It's like the bro- the straw that broke the camel's back because there was already stress in the system. Mm-hmm. Uh, and that can definitely come back to a variety of different reasons, just mercury being one of them.
**Unknown:** Right. Because when it comes back to the neurotoxins and this, you know, this connection to fibromyalgia is, yes, there can be mercury. Yes, there can be mold. Then there's aluminum, and we put aluminum on our armpits every day using antiperspirant.
**Unknown:** Oh, we don't, but- ... other people do. Other people do. Um, but then on top of it, we now are living in this era that there's organic and, and people don't always know, like, what does it all mean?
**Unknown:** Like do I- There's fake organic. Yeah. Do I have to eat organic? Do I not?
**Unknown:** Like what- like does it really matter? But at this point, there's 262 pesticides that are being used, which, uh, a lot of them are neurotoxic, especially the specific, um, pesticide that's being used with GMOs, or it's actually being, um, grown or manufactured in a lab. So the GMOs contain Roundup, which is something called glyphosate, and that has its own neurological implications as well. So at the end of the day, the, the biggest point that I wanna make is that-We get exposed to a variety of different things throughout our lives.
**Unknown:** Um, it takes a long time for us to develop this type of toxic stress that it causes us to have something like the fibromyalgia or causes us to have the rheumatoid arthritis or starts to cause, you know, these other pain syndromes and pain patterns. But it's not that you have to live with it forever, number one, and it's also not that it's super, super difficult to heal from all of this. Because if you take the step back and you get away from the diagnosis of the fibromyalgia or the rheumatoid, and you look at the body from a, a whole view, and you start to look at, like, what's stressing the system, number one, but also what systems need the most support. And what I personally find is such a common denominator nowadays because of all the things we're exposed to is that our body's filtration systems are completely overloaded.
**Unknown:** And, and that's the thing is, like, we call it aging, but when we were younger, we felt pretty good because all of our filters were working. Yeah. So, like, your liver was filtering out bad stuff you got exposed to from food. Your tonsils are getting rid of things that you got exposed to through, um, drinking things, kissing other people, like, whatever.
**Unknown:** I don't wanna know about your past. Shut up. Um, and then you have your kidneys that filter out anything that gets into your blood, and then you have your lymph nodes, which are generally just clearing out things that are, are harmful to your immune system. So the more and more things we get exposed to over years on years on years, then it just gets to the point that those filters don't work very well, and we start to become this ball of inflammation, this ball of toxicity, and then we start to have all of these really weird patterns of pain, brain fog, fatigue, et cetera.
**Unknown:** And then we are kind of, like, drawing at straws trying to figure out, like, what's wrong with me, and we get slapped with a diagnosis that merely just describes our symptoms. Yep. And that, I think, is one of the biggest detriments to healthcare is that all we're really striving for is give me a name for my symptoms, and then what usually comes along with that as a solution is a medication or a surgery. Yeah, I mean, there was the lady with the headaches.
**Unknown:** You know, she was just given all those pain meds to... And she's like, "Finally enough's enough." But then even if we'd found out it was a gallbladder meridian, and if all we did was treat the gallbladder meridian, it would've came back because the gallbladder was still stressed, causing the meridian dysfunction. Mm-hmm. So it's not just of, you know, taking it one step further and figuring out what's causing the meridian to be stressed.
**Unknown:** Mm-hmm. Because that was causing her symptom, but that wasn't the end-all be-all cause. Mm-hmm. So it's like you have to take it and figure out, we had to support the gallbladder.
**Unknown:** We had to support the liver. Mm-hmm. We had to change some of the diet up and then also at the same time, you know, fix the gallbladder meridian. Well, and I think that's huge what you're saying because I know for us in our practice, we specifically have changed who we are and what we do to be integrative because we want to create sustainability with someone's progress.
**Unknown:** I think the most frustrating thir- thing for me, um, in the early years of being a physician was having somebody go on an elimination diet, having people take certain supplements, and then as soon as they derailed from that, they went right back to where they were. There, there's like a crutch they're dependent on. Yeah. And that I just found...
**Unknown:** I was like, this isn't healthcare. I'm pretty much just doing a more natural version of traditional medicine. So I wanted to figure out a way, um, using the technologies, using, you know, advanced, uh, integrative therapies of how can we cover all of the bases to allow someone to get to a place that they can have balance in their lives and not have to backtrack and be worried that they're gonna go backwards. And I think that one of the things that I love the most is if we do figure out that somebody has these overloaded filtration systems, like, everyone's a little bit different, and this definitely has to do with genetics.
**Unknown:** So, like, as an example, if someone, um, comes to me and we're talking about, you know, diet and they say like, "Oh my gosh, I'm so sensitive to caffeine," um, or, "I was on birth control and I still got pregnant," like, that tells me that they have, um, a liver that is either an under metabolizer or an over metabolizer. So, like, an under metabolizer is the person that has, like, three sips of coffee, and they're, like, wired for three days. So that means that you need to take more special care to your liver, like, forever. Like, you just have to be conscious of, okay, let me make sure that I'm getting, um, cruciferous vegetables in like broccoli and cauliflower and kale so that I always kind of keep my liver functioning better.
**Unknown:** And then the same thing if somebody has, um, a, a lymphatic system that is weaker genetically. So what that looks like, by the way, is women, especially women, but, uh, people that have a lot of varicose veins in their family or they don't sweat, they go to the gym, they only glisten, like, those are signs that your lymphatic system might be your weaker system. So something like that, like, make sure that you just routinely get a lymphatic massage or you get yourself into some type of heat if that's, like, an infrared sauna or even a regular sauna. Dry brushing daily.
**Unknown:** Dry brushing. Like, there's a lot of tools, and I just love being able to dig deep in someone's results and be able to say, "Hey, you know, this is something that you need to keep in mind just as a way for you to maintain your body in the future." Because all of us, you know, down to the genetic level have certain systems that are weaker than others. Like, I know for me it's my lymphatic system. So, you know, once a week-Mainly because I have a sauna, I go once a week to make sure that I get a sauna, and I do hot yoga.
**Unknown:** So, like, that's one of my maintenance protocols for my body. And I give myself the flexibility with my diet. I'm not, like, hardcore anything. I definitely listen to my body, and I'll go and have gluten sometimes, and will have some wine sometimes because I wanna have balance there.
**Unknown:** It's, it's- And I also know more about my body. But it's good quality gluten. It's not the crazy- Yeah, of course ... yeah I'm not eating Entenmann's.
**Unknown:** I did when I was a kid. Entenmann's. Who knows what those did to my body. But, but it's just important to, for people to walk away with that knowledge, um, and knowing that it's not about you living in a bubble, 'cause I have a lot of people that I personally work with that I know come in and they're stressed.
**Unknown:** They're just like, "I threw out all my pots and pans. I got rid of my antiperspirant. I threw out my makeup. I got rid of my, you know, all my cleaning products, and I made all these switches." And I'm like ...
**Unknown:** "And, uh, my kids, I'm scared that they're gonna get exposed to this when they go to school." And I'm like, "That's not a way to live." Like, it's just impossible for you to think that you're gonna navigate around germs, you're gonna navigate around toxins. But if you can know how to keep your body's filtration systems working, you're not only gonna just be in better health, but you're going to have so many less issues with inflammation and pain. S- I mean, that's what we're talking about today, is decrease in pain. Yes.
**Unknown:** But, and I think a couple of other important aspects to know about referred pain is you, we were talking about the gallbladder and how if it's a meridian issue, it comes up and wraps around the head. But also too, if the, there's no meridian involved and it's truly just the gallbladder super stressed, the most common pain pattern is pain between the shoulder blades. And the meridian does cross to the shoulder blade right about there. Yes.
**Unknown:** So but that's, I think it's just important for people to know- Oh, yeah ... it's pain between the shoulder blades, could be pain wrapping to the side of your head near your temple. Um, if somebody has kidney issues, like maybe you've had a ton of urinary tract infections and, you know, you're asymptomatic, but you may still have residual issues because of how many you've had in your past. You could have referred pain from your kidney, and that would be, like, in the back ribcage area.
**Unknown:** So you can easily- And even when it comes to, like, adrenals too, like I found a decent amount of, um, like athletes will come in, their hamstrings or their, um, their adductors, the muscles on the inside of their legs, um, will be really weak and they'll strain them, uh, over. A lot of times that has a connection with, you know, the psoas, but also coming up, uh, to the adrenals and the kidney as well. Yeah, so the adrenals, uh, make adrenaline. So adrenals are great for helping us maintain our energy levels, but if we're go, go, go, you know, not sleeping, you know, burning the candle at both ends, we're going to burn out our adrenal glands.
**Unknown:** And you could easily have pain patterns in the legs like Dr. Nick's describing. Tons of possibilities. Um, but another thing too, and I know for women, is we are always, like, trying to gauge our hormones and seeing, you know, if that's part of why we're having symptoms.
**Unknown:** And, uh, something really interesting is when you talk about, like, cramps, and you talk about having, um, loose bowel movements around your period, or always having, like, stomach problems around your period, a lot of times that's because, it's not because of your hormones, it's because your reproductive organs and your, um, gut are so close in proximity. So if you have a lot of inflammation in your intestines, especially on the left side, which is your descending colon, which pretty much is the end of your colon right before your rectum. Then if you're, like, when you have your period, your ovaries and your uterus, they all swell to shed off the tissue. So if that swells and starts to hit your already inflamed descending colon, you're going to have loose bowel movements and diarrhea.
**Unknown:** So it's really just significant to kind of understand that there's so many possibilities with pain being from organs, being from meridian patterns and toxicity, is really what it comes down to. Especially if you're dealing with, um, a lot of, like, these neurological pain patterns, which has to do with fibromyalgia or even just migrating pain- Mm-hmm ... as well. So.
**Unknown:** Question with that, just 'cause I don't know the answer. Okay. What, what's the lack of blood, uh, 'cause females have blood loss during their menstruation, how does that affect the pain? So with the blood loss, like, if someone is already- I mean, is it just decreased oxygen and nutrients?
**Unknown:** Or is it- Well, yeah. So you, no matter what, uh, if you have your menstrual cycle, you're gonna lose iron. Um, obviously if you're already iron deficient, you're going to bottom out. Right.
**Unknown:** And that will affect the oxygenation to your tissues. So you might find you're very, very fatigued with your period. Um, I would say women will experience more fatigue from that than pain. Than pain?
**Unknown:** Okay. Um, but definitely the fatigue is, is a big one. And, you know, we, we kinda learn to live with it. We just learn to be like, "My periods suck, and that's just kind of it for me." And there's, i- it's a lot of things that is more of an effect, um, because of either issues in the reproductive system or even issues in the surrounding area, which could be the gut as well.
**Unknown:** Mm-hmm. So there's a lot of, um, a lot of things to consider, and that's the beauty of what we do and the integrative approach, is when you come in, you might come in and be like, "I have terrible periods. My hormones are all over the place," but we're gonna look at everything. 'Cause we don't want to necessarily look at you from a linear perspective and be chasing symptoms.
**Unknown:** We wanna see if there's something that is contributing to those symptoms. Because if we can figure that out and nip it, then you'll be able to not just resolve the reason you came in, but resolve all the other things that you learned to live with. Yeah. Which is your fatigue, and your occasional brain fog, and your occasional stomach aches.
**Unknown:** You know, especially when things are occasional, um-We blame it on something else. We say, "Oh, well, I ate out. That's why my stomach hurts this week," or, "Oh, I didn't get enough sleep," or, "Oh, my pillow sucks. Oh, I slept in a hotel room." And we just kind of make excuses for why we feel the way we do, and then we also don't consider it, uh, to be significant if it only comes and goes.
**Unknown:** So, and this is all of us. I know that I used to do the same thing, um, before I knew that all of these symptoms were just, uh, my body's feedback mechanism. Nice. Well, I think we covered a lot.
**Unknown:** See, I told you this is my zone. I love this. Um, so I guess to sum it up, the, the, the premise behind this is that if you have, uh, been struggling with some type of issue with pain, it doesn't matter if it's everything as, as extreme as fibromyalgia, rheumatoid arthritis, even down to I have occasional low back pain. It's really a matter of you digging a little bit deeper before you get under the knife.
**Unknown:** Um, there are so many surgeries that we have seen that, um, didn't necessarily resolve the problem because it wasn't the root cause. Right. And our goal is to educate so people understand the bigger picture but also have a solution before they do something, you know, extreme like, you know, fuse half of their spine or, you know, remove organs and other things. That being said, if you have a loved one, a friend's, like, thinking about doing something crazy like that, um, just send them the podcast and get them, you know, a different perception before they go in and make that really strong decision.
**Unknown:** 'Cause unfortunately, especially when it comes to low back surgeries, they say 95% of them fail. Yeah. It's- And, and again, you think about how many organs are, are in that area that could be playing a role. Yeah.
**Unknown:** So, um, so we thank you so much for being here and listening. Um, we really hope you enjoyed it. Share this with your friends, and, uh, keep your eye out for our next podcast. We thank you for being a listener and subscriber to Integrative Wellness Radio.
**Unknown:** If you're looking to learn more about Integrative Wellness Group as well as Dr. Nick or Dr. Nicole, you can check out integrativewellnessgroup.com. All night, no sleep.
**Unknown:** 'Cause I feel like I'm always dreaming. Wide awake, that's okay
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About Integrative You Radio
Integrative You Radio is a root cause medicine and integrative medicine podcast hosted by Dr. Nicole Rivera and Dr. Nick Carruthers — two integrative doctors who build personalized wellness protocols from your DNA, minerals, hormones, gut, and nervous system rather than from a population template. Looking for an integrative doctor who reads your labs together instead of in isolation? This is the show.
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